ASA wrong, AS 6.5 right
Hi,
I've had some serious doubts about the accuracy of ASA's depiction for some time, but this weeks known blizzardy conditions in the Rockies provides a good example of what I'm talking about.
Here is my setup: Running FSX SP2, ASA on a networked machine. Simconnect works fine. Not using Global mode, dwc, since that isn't very realistic; disabled Haze layer checked; Fog layer Generation checked. I only use offline historical weather, with ASA forced to Sim Time. ASA build 433 and later 435.
Using weather from Oct 28, 15z, started flight from KDEN. It should have been snowing cats and dogs, but instead only a bit of fog. No snow, even though the Metar specified it. IMC yes, but accurate, no.
Climbing out of 10,000, the world suddenly becomes VFR above and below, as far as the eye can see, with a few scattered clouds. No snow on the ground. Turning back around to land, I set up the landing visually, until I hit the "fog layer" at which point everything is back to soup again. The depiction is totally wrong. I have read about these problems in FS9, but I am using FSX.
I tested out the same scenario using AS 6.5 with a WideFs connection. This time I'm getting depiction exactly as it should be. Icy runways, medium snow, consistent, low visibility. And when I pop up above 10-15 thousand, the world is as expected, everything below me covered in thick clouds, like a blanket.
I have tried just about every combination of ASA settings to get accurate weather and nothing and no version works. I would go back to AS 6.5 if only it didn't toss my plane out of the sky in FSX when the wind changes. I must emphasize that my example above is not a special situation or a screwed up Metar. I have never gotten ASA to depict true, "turn-on-the-weather-channel" conditions the way 6.5 did always.
I really hope somebody can help, I'm really looking forward to enjoying good weather in FSX. Thanks in advance!
asa_log data
Here are my logs. This is weather 10/28/09 ~15gmt, while sitting on the runway, KDEN:
Also, I have attached the following pictures of what should be the same situations using asa and as6.5:
Even though the names are explanatory, just for clarity:
as65north.jpg=looking north towards KDEN from a few miles away, altitude ~20,000
as65runway.jpg=Using 6.5 while sitting on the runway at KDEN approximately 15z
asarunway.jpg=KDEN rw using active sky advanced
asanorth.jpg=looking towards KDEN, altitude about 15k
Also I am using payware FSUIPC on the FSX machine
Thanks
Hi, From looking at the log
Hi,
From looking at the log file I can suggest that you are not giving ASA enough time to process and send the weather to FSX.
Start everything and just sit for 5 minutes. Don't move in FSX, or refresh, or do anything. Then see what happens.
Also, make sure that Lock to Closest on checked On in ASA.
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
Refresh Time
Thanks for your prompt response on this and your continued attention to this problem. Rumor has it, you guys have great customer support, and I think that I might be seeing this in action:)
I have run that particular situation almost a dozen times, and have, unfortunately, already tried letting everything sit there on the runway for times as long as 15 minutes. No luck. I can also confirm that I have Lock to Closest set in the Report Screen, with the KDEN metar correctly showing. I also have Lock to Closest set in the map. Winds appear to be correct. I have included the Simconnect log from the same run as the previously provided ASA_log...not sure if that might shed some light.
I also tried to force Heavy Snow from the WX config screen, and waited about 10 minutes. Nothing changed.
I take it you guys concur that the depiction should be like the one in 6.5, and also that conditions shouldn't just suddenly become VFR-ish above 10,000?
Hi, With FSX running on your
Hi,
With FSX running on your main computer, please run the AI Traffic Utility on your client computer and tell me what happens.
Do you also have FSX installed on your client computer?
Thanks
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
ai_traffic test result
Hi,
reverified the simconnect test results as per page 53 of the manual. Couldn't cut and paste, so I included a screen shot...but basically it looked ok. I let if run for maybe about 5 minutes.
Just to sort of brainstorm some of the things I've considered on my end...here is my setup. FSX runs on a Vista64 machine, latest updates. ASA runs on an XP Pro SP2 machine. For performance and connectivity reasons, all virus checking software is off on both machines when I'm running the sims (which is why I need to run offline). I have no issue with User permissions or Administrator privs. I can see that the weather station list is being updated on the FSX machine. My ASA purchase is the Upgrade from 6.5, which is build 522, and my upgrade path for ASA was...RTM->SP1->build 435. At one time I had the initial ASA on the FSX machine, updated up to build 431? or something and I recall having similar depiction problems even with that setup. I have experimented with various payware planes as well as the Trike. ....OK..I'm almost done with my list!
At one time, both Fs9 and FSX did in fact reside on the XP client machine, but they have been uninstalled. I don't see them in the Add or Remove Software screen anymore, and I regularly use Registry Mechanic to make sure there are no remnants. I have erased their respective directories. Lastly, I'm pretty confident in my FSX sp2 install on the server, since everything else hangs together very well with all of my payware planes and other addons. My simconnect CLIENT on the xp machine says "Microsoft Flight Simulator Simconnect Client v10.0.61259.0" on the add/remove software screen. I hope this is right, because re-install of FSX and its associated SDK is not a path I wish to go down at this time.
I know you all are busy as heck there, and probably tired of me by now, but have you or any of the testers run the 10/28 15z offline historical Kden setup? If so, what are you seeing, both on the RW and above? Thnx
Hi, The Traffic test is
Hi,
The Traffic test is normal, but that Simconnect log you sent me before is just showing a bunch of connection errors.
If you jump from airport to airport in FSX, does ASA recognize your current locations in FSX?
Is it just this one file that doesn't work for you? I have not had the time to load up my FSX and try that file.
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
OK, I'm recanting my promise
OK, I'm recanting my promise to let this thread die, and I'm officially a pain in the butt:)
Jim, you have noted that my simconnect log shows a bunch of errors such as:
6:57:40 PM:0593 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Connected to FS
6:57:51 PM:0937 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Exception received: SIMCONNECT_EXCEPTION_DATA_ERROR
6:59:52 PM:0890 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Exception received: SIMCONNECT_EXCEPTION_DATA_ERROR
7:00:58 PM:0796 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Exception received: SIMCONNECT_EXCEPTION_DATA_ERROR
7:02:05 PM:0093 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Exception received: SIMCONNECT_EXCEPTION_DATA_ERROR
7:02:45 PM:0265 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Connection closed
7:02:46 PM:0921 - Pre Connect FS_Connected = False
7:02:46 PM:0921 - FSX Connect Pre Attempt: Instantiated = True / mConnected = False
7:02:46 PM:0921 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: fsx_simconnect is NOTHING ...
so what does that mean? Just because it is throwing me an error does not mean there is a problem with my server/client configuration. Could this just be a bug with ASA? Somebody must have encountered this before...
Hi, It is not ASA generating
Hi,
It is not ASA generating this error or the resulting log file. It is your Simconnect install/setup and this log is being generated by SimConnect. What you might try is on the client go through and uninstall and reinstall the versions of SimConnect needed.
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
Alrighty then...
At the bottom of page 51 of the ASA manual it says "if you are using FSUIPC..." It tells you to rerun the FSUIPC install...the effect of this, I can see, is to add the following lines to the Simconnect.xml file:
False
Auto
local
THAT is what is causing the DATA_HANDLING_EXCEPTION error that you see in my simconnect log. When I remove these lines, the error goes away and my simconnect log is clean as a whistle. I assume somebody must have written these instructions into your manual because FSUIPC really does require it, so I will leave the inserted lines in there. That is the good news.
The bad news, however, is that it has no effect on the operation of ASA whether it is in there or not. The depiction is the same down to the individual clouds in the sky.
I reinstalled the simconnect client as you suggested, and that didn't seem to improve the situation. Could you post me an example of what a "good" ASA_simconnectionLog.txt should look like when everything is working? That way I'm hoping we can rule out/rule in, the question of my client/server configuration once and for all. Thanks
Hi, FSX and ASA do not use
Hi,
FSX and ASA do not use FSUIPC at all. You don't even need FSUIPC installed at all, either with Wide Client on the client computer or FSUIPC4 on the FSX computer. All ASA and FSX use is SimConnect. The bottom of page 51 is for those programs that may require FSUIPC.
Here is my log from yesterday:
6:37:56 PM:0445 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Connection request sent ...
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
You might have misunderstood
You might have misunderstood my last post. I never said or was under the impression that FSUIPC or Widefs was required. I'm just saying that I am using both for other things, and the simconnect data_handling_exception error seemed to be caused by following the steps on page 51. More importantly, however, I pointed out that it made no difference to the depiction whether I did that or step or not. When ommiting the page51 step, my depiction is exactly the same...plus my simconnect log shows NO red-flag type errors. Here is an example with the pre-connect and post-connect "waiting" messages removed.
4:04:41 AM:0792 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Connected to FS
4:16:16 AM:0245 - Sim general message:Sim Msg: Connection closed
At this point I don't see anything at all to indicate that my simconnect/SP2 install is at fault. I've read a lot of the stuff on the avsim simconnect forums and if there was something bogus about my SDK build I don't think I would even be getting weather injection at all. The previously indicated error messages have been resolved.
Correct me if otherwise, but the one line of your own simconnect log seems to indicate that you are not personally running a networked configuration so comparing our logs might be apples and oranges. I am really curious what kind of weather you would get if you were to run the exact same scenario that I have used, networked or otherwise. if you get correct, snowy, icy conditions and a blanket of clouds below you when above 15,000, then that strongly indicates the error is on my end. Thanks.
Hi, Yes I am running a
Hi,
Yes I am running a networked set up and yes that was the latest log generated when I ran ASA on my client computer and FSX on my server computer.
Now, let's take a look at your latest ASA_Log.txt file when the weather in ASA does not match up or is even close to the weather in FSX.
Thanks!
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
My latest ASA_log
Here ya go.
I have also included a screenshot of something else I discovered when generating it. As I said, I only run with offline weather. This time I set the time to July 22 at a time I had weather for. I noticed that although the "active" date and time updates correctly, the active metar doesn't change at all. It is still the last-downloaded file, which in this case is snow from Oct 28. (it still didn't depict any snow, by the way) I hadn't noticed this before. When I went to the open screen, and explicitly loaded the weather from July, the depiction did change to correctly depict a sunny day, but the metar string still didn't update in the GUI. In addition to the current depiction problem we are working, could you confirm wether or not ASA even does sequential offline weather the way AS6.5 did? Unfortunately, that in itself would be a deal breaker for me (I run offline because even though I have a very fast FSX machine, I simply don't have enough juice to run the anti-virus stuff in the background)
Hi, Did you shut down ASA at
Hi,
Did you shut down ASA at the end or did it close by itself? ASA wasn't done processing al the weather and stations.
No, ASA will not run sequential offline files.
Is FS set to use system time?
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
I shut down ASA after first shutting down FSX
I started FSX, cleared the weather with FSUIPC, then on the client I started ASA. After letting it sit there for, it looks like 8 minutes, I shut down FSX, then ASA. I am absolutely positive that I am giving this program enough time to complete the depiction, whether that particular ASA_log demonstrates it or not. We have already examined that possibility earlier. I've let that same weather sit there for an hour and not experienced anything different. As in the picture (sorry if its hard to read), I am using set to FS time, but since you've just broken the news that automatically sequenced offline weather isn't a feature of ASA, I guess that doesn't matter.
Just to understand you correctly, if I fly a 6 hour flight, the weather at my destination will be 6 hours old plus ASA dynamic changes, because it will only handle the one downloaded file?
I think at this point I must shelve ASA and just use AS6.5, which I think is fantastic. We can go ahead and end this thread now...Thanks for sticking through this for the last week with me. If you ever do get a chance however, I would still be curious to see what depicts on your system with the same time and place (10/28/15z KDEN) Thanks.
Hi, That one file did not
Hi,
That one file did not decode correctly for my only at KDEN. Nearby stations were all shown correctly. Then I switched to realtime weather and everything was fine.
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support
After this post
After this post, I think I will let this thread lay fallow for a while and see if anything new arises. However since I just spent the last 4 hours doing tests, I can report the following:
1) ASA tracks my position and time without error all over the globe, loading the right metar
2) Weather depiction is totally inconsistent from one time to another and one place to another. I managed to get a so-so depiction of a blizzard in Albany, with fairly consistent visibility layers (though it was limited to a rather smallish cloud bank over the airport) whereas somewhere else, where it is reported as heavy rain, just gives a little bit of fog which suddenly vanishes at altitude. I made sure I had the archived files available, and gave ASA plenty of time to complete the depictions. I wasn't happy with the depictions, in so far as they don't make logical sense, although it is hard for me to say what it really looks like out the window in some far off land.
3) Wind, temperature and pressure seem to be OK
4) Visibility RANGE seems accurate, as far as I can tell.
5) Voice ATIS works just fine
6) My problems are not plane related...default or payware.
7)The only thing that might make DEN special is its altitude. I didn't think this was an issue so long as GLOBAL mode is off, which it is. I didn't have a problem with ground hugging clouds during fair weather tests (unlike default FSX)
I think we might have reached a dead end, but I really do appreciate your help, Jim. Thanks
Hi, Please post your
Hi,
Please post your ASA_Log.txt file and I'll be happy to take a look.
Thanks,
Jim - HiFi Software Sales and Support